The "Friend Zone" :)

This is an amusing read:

Top 10 reasons why...

My reaction (by the reason numbers):

1) Of course it's real. It's been around a long time, and now it formally has a name. (I think it used to be called "LJBF", but "FZ is better".)

OK, what IS the friend zone? It's when a woman you have some romantic interest in tells you "I've always thought of you as [just] a friend" -- which means that she DOES NOT and CANNOT see you as a romantic interest. When they say that to you, it is time to walk away. Take the ego hit and go. Permanently.Getting pushed into the "FZ" is a one-way trip.

2) You have only just so much time to spend on "the pursuit". You cannot afford to spend any on a woman who has "FZ'd" you. Not any. Move on. Be courteous if you bump into her, but you will never be seen as a romantic partner. (Alright, maybe it's not a statistical impossibility, but the probability is vanishingly small, don't waste time on it.)

3) Actually, it's a very subtle attack: what it really means is "please go away and don't be a stalker". She did not give you "the truth", because part of the truth involves words she doesn't want to say.

4) True enough, but since they can't say the words it really means, it's another self-deception on their part. You acted like one of her female friends, so that's how you got classified. Don't allow it.

5) What is a "nice guy" ? One who isn't going to hit her? Remember that they want some measure of excitement. Don't hit her, ever, but don't let her think you're a doormat. Either act like she's a romantic target or do not interact with her at all.

6) Have never done this. Well, not that I am aware of...I remember, well, let's go ahead and say "dumping" two girlfriends, but they were actual girlfriends I'd had sex with, not women who'd been interested but I ignored. That sort of thing could not happen to me. Why? I am not a guy who attracts women. At all. So there is no possible occurrence where I would FZ one, because there wouldn't be a circumstance where there would be one who had a romantic interest in me and she made the initial approach. So of course you can describe the hypothetical of "well what if one did?" but since that can't happen to me, I would be 100% incapable of recognizing it, and would be certain that there was some other meaning to the initial contact and would react accordingly. (My superpower was and still is being invisible to women :) )

7) Women don't complain about it because they are running a master class in self-deception, and that includes careful code-phrases like "It just didn't work out", which is much gentler on one's self than "he thought I was boring/unattractive".

8) As I am not any woman's "type" this doesn't even mean anything to me. It is true as written. (fwiw, I'd go with Zooey, (unless she was blond at the time, that just does not work for Zooey) but since nothing of the kind could happen, it still doesn't mean anything)

9) Correct as written. Move on. Immediately. Do not give her a second glance. It ain't happening.

10) Mostly right. You got rejected, in a way that allows her to pretend to herself that she didn't "reject" you. She still doesn't want to see you ever again, since what it means is that she doesn't think you are exciting or attractive.

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The Friend Zone is a female thing. Women put you in it so as not to think about you as a romantic partner, and to avoid saying "I don't think you're attractive".

(Repeating from a recent prior blog wherein Ben Affleck was mentioned:)

Scenario: you're female, single, 27. You live by yourself (or with female roommates), in an apartment. There's a knock at the door. You answer, a guy is there, you've not met before. He says "come have dinner with me". What are the first words out of your mouth?

1) Get out of here you creep! (followed by slamming the door and locking it)
2) I've always thought of you as a friend.
3) Give me five minutes to change clothes. How dressed up should I look?

The answer to this is 100% based on how good-looking he is. If it's one of those dorks from Dumb and Dumber, you say #1. If it's Harold from the Accounting dept, you say #2. If it's (your pick) Ben Affleck or Benedict Cumberbatch, you say #3, after you pick your jaw up off the floor.


Variation: flip the sexes. You're male, single, 27. You live alone, of course. At the apartment, a knock comes on the door. You answer, it's a female, she says "come have dinner with me". What do you say?

1) Buzz off slut!
2) I'm unfortunately busy this evening.
3) Let me get my jacket.
4) Am I on Candid Camera?

The answer to this is 100% based on how good-looking she is. If she looks like Mama June, you either say #1 or just close the door and think wtf (followed by holding that beer bottle up to the light and wondering if there are some hallucinogenics in it and why you didn't hallucinate Lynda Carter)? If she looks like Amy from BBT you likely say #2 (unless it looks like she has good-sized tits, or it's Mayim and she looks like this). If she looks like Deepika, you say #3, regardless of whatever the hell else other circumstances exist (even if you're getting married tomorrow), you don't even need to change clothes, because no one is even going to see you other than to wonder who's that guy with Deepika?

No guy is going to say "I've always thought of you as just a friend".

(If you're me, there are only two phrases: "I'm sorry" and you close the door, or "I'm sorry, you've confused me with someone else" (and that is even if it's Deepika) because of course there's absolutely no way a female is going to come knock on my door).


So, another anecdote. (Anecdotes are not data.) Long ago, there was an exchange with an ex-gf:

(I forget the precise timing, it was after the break-up, but perhaps not long after)

Her: can we still be friends? Oh, wait, I forgot, you don't have female "friends".

Me: Your sarcasm is wasted. [I'll be polite, but I won't go any farther than that, if our paths cross again]

I don't know what she meant by "friends", as there weren't any circumstances that would cause us to be within a mile of each other again after that, and we wouldn't be talking on the phone (and this was long before email).

The amount of time I have to spend interacting with women must be focused on the romantic angle, I do not have time to be "friends". What does that even mean?



Another anecdote  (we'll see if I can even remember this completely, I think it was 1988):

Female cousin (age ~26) says to me: I'm in this singles group at church, it's a big group, and I never get asked out. (which I is guess basically the raison d'etre for a church singles group)

Me:Why don't YOU ask one of THEM? Can't hurt...

Weeks or months later...

Cousin: well, I tried that. I got told he didn't want to damage his friendship with {her ex-boyfriend} [so I hadn't known about that at all] [as though an ex-boyfriend would care even slightly].

Me: [probably something like:] Huh. wow. Well...

What was I going to tell her? The reality of that was: He didn't find you attractive enough. [True enough; at the time she was a bit overweight] Simple as that. I guarantee you that if she had looked like (let's pick a well-known actress at that specific time) Kathleen Turner in Body Heat (~same age as cousin in that movie) or Romancing the Stone, the guy she asked would have been more than willing to ignore anything else for her. (Of course this ignores the fact that if she looked like KT in Body Heat she'd have had to fight guys off with a stick just to get out to her car)

So that was a lie he told her to dodge giving the real answer: I don't find you attractive. (And of course I didn't say it either, wimping out to an extent, I couldn't see a good reason to do so.) Also note that he didn't say "I've always thought of you as a friend".

The other important lesson in that episode is that she learns just how hard it is for most of us to ask them out, the insecurity, the second-guessing in advance, the agonizing over whether today is the right day. I sure don't want to have to think about that again.